Contents 1 What Counts as a Life State? 2 New Pet life states 3 Snake 4 Raccoon 5 Dragons 6 Redesigning and redefining template 7 Island Paradise

What Counts as a Life State?Edit

There is obviously some controversy over what counts as a "life state" and what doesn't. Most of the "life states" included on here are unplayable NPCs, but also uniquely modelled "forms of life". We've traditionally always included the genie as a life state, despite being an NPC? Do raccoon and deer qualify? Or should we remove the likes of Pack Leader and Skunk? Kiwi tea 15:23, February 18, 2012 (UTC)

I have the same question before and discuss this with rose long time ago, what "criteria" is considered as lifestate and npc. First a lifestate is based on normal sim or animal, for the example is genie. genie is based on sim, they look like sim even they not controllable another is leader of the pack is based on dog so is considered as lifestate, and skunk is a lifestate because when it is opened in SimPE, it is a cat. Second is interaction, how much we can interact with it. example a genie, we can interact with it with wish, we can wish money, beauty, young again, etc and we still dont know what interaction in the sims 3 showtime, now leader of the pack, we can interact with it same as normal dog. now we see raccoon, deer, cow, penguin, why we put this on npc not a lifestate? because we cant interact with it or it has very limited interaction with it, we only can pet raccoon, deer, penguin and none with cow. so why the are an npc not a lifestate. :) Wiryawan310 15:43, February 18, 2012 (UTC)

Does it make any difference that raccoons ARE actually cats? :P Kiwi tea 15:55, February 18, 2012 (UTC)

IMO, it does not. Dharden (talk) 16:04, February 18, 2012 (UTC)

If you can found a simPE for the sims 3, check it, and it is a cat, it become a lifestate, just like skunk, for the first time it is not a lifestate, but Nikel found that it is a cat via simPE so it is a lifestate now.

for me personally, raccoons is a lifestate because when I see a raccoon sleeping, they behave like a cat when sleeping. but since I cant prove it, it is not a lifestate... Wiryawan310 16:09, February 18, 2012 (UTC)

Just a note, penguin is a moving object in The Sims 2: Seasons, and Cow could be considered animated object as well. Showtime Genie (I believe) will give more proof that Genie is a life state. I hope others can join the discussion whether Raccoon and Deer are life states too... Nikel _Talk 16:13, February 18, 2012 (UTC)

There is different coding for raccoons in places, but in terms of their actual substance they are literally reskinned cats *exactly* like the skunk, and the game files manage them as NPC cats in a distinct service role within the invisible service household. In terms of the game's code they are just cats who have a job. They have unique behaviours in terms of knocking over bins and what objects/situations attract them. However, I feel we're either being much too broad, or much too narrow in our definitions of "life state". Seeing as this is entirely a taxonomic issue, I propose we redefine "life state" more clearly, adopting the maxim on the actual "Life state" page - A SIM with UNIQUE appearance and abilities. This would instantly disqualify objects like the penguin or the minor pets - these aren't actually simulated Sims. But it would include Sims that the game actually manages a simulation of - for example the game coding clearly shows that raccoons and deer, as boring as they are, are managed as Sims and use the usual simulation routines to have "wants" and to express behaviours.

Alternatively, I propose we make playability a criterion, so that unplayable NPCs are no longer considered "life states".

It's also important to point out that as our definitions stand "NPC" and "life state" are clearly not mutually exclusive categories. Lots of our current life states are also NPCs. Kiwi tea 16:53, February 18, 2012 (UTC)

Kiwi Tea really made the point here, but I disagree if you point out NPC as not a life state. In the past, someone asked why Social Bunny wasn't a life state. Social Bunny is just a costumed Sim with an NPC code, just like mascots. Life states such as Bigfoot, Werewolf, or Vampire do have attributes and abilities.

Now, I suppose we must clear the confusion. "Animal Life State", in my opinion, is too vague to be defined. After thinking a bit... this is more like "Types of animals" instead of "Animal life states". I don't want to use the term Animal Life State anymore, just because the existence of Unicorn. What do you think about this? Nikel _Talk 09:43, February 22, 2012 (UTC)

Also, if you think a bit... the animal life states have more species than the state itself, making "Types of animals" more rational. Nikel _Talk 09:47, February 22, 2012 (UTC)

I tend to agree with Nikel, those suggestions make even more sense. I suggest were add "Unicorn" to the life states page, and have a separate category for "Animal Sims" that has none of the confusion associated with defining a "life state".Kiwi tea 19:15, February 22, 2012 (UTC)

No, Unicorn must be separated from Sims' Life States. But it's fine if Unicorn is placed alongside with animal types (or species). But before this is done, we have to bring up this discussion back to the community so they'll notice about this. Nikel _Talk 12:40, February 23, 2012 (UTC)

I don't know. In the game code the unicorn is an "Occult", which is really just the official name for "life state". Does it matter that it's also an animal? And yes, there needs to be wider input on this. Kiwi tea 13:23, February 23, 2012 (UTC)

Actually, yes. It does matter, and it has since quite long ago since Pets was released. You see, Unicorns aren't supposed to be part of Sims' life states. They'd better be along with the animals. Unicorns will suit more there. Nikel _Talk 11:07, February 24, 2012 (UTC)

New Pet life statesEdit

Is orangutan a pet life state. I'm asking this because there are several reasons for it being one:

• First, the orangutan isn't a copy of an original pet (like a Hyena is actually a modified dog wiht just special skin or Jaguar is a large cat, literally).
• It has it's own needs, skills, careers, etc.
• Unlike other pets, it's fully controlable.
• The orangutan itself only appears in one game as an animal.

So should we keep the orangutan as a life state or remove it from the template. Does this also count for Hyenas and Jaguras, I mean, are they also pet life states too? Vss2eip^{talk here} 19:51, October 1, 2011 (UTC)

I think they should go in this template. DanPin (Talk) 22:14, October 1, 2011 (UTC)

Woah, I didn't know there was a page for orangutan, really. And where did you get the icon? It doesn't look... The Sims 2-ish... Nikel _Talk 02:25, October 2, 2011 (UTC)
Also, in this case, maybe we should consider the name again, comparing "Pets" to "Animals" instead... Nikel _Talk 02:28, October 2, 2011 (UTC)

Snake Edit

Snakes THE SIMS 3: comment soon.

RaccoonEdit

Can someone add raccoon to the list?. If skunk and wolf are on the list then raccoon should be too.

DragonsEdit

I know this sounds silly, but I'm so excited that we can replace the dragon icon in the template once Dragon Valley is released! The icon we currently have is so ugly, and simply doesn't fit in. Cavia (wheek • speak) 14:50, April 29, 2013 (UTC)

I hate to let you down, but unless the dragon gives a unique dragon moodlet, there won't be any new icons from that. Premium objects simply don't have icons other than moodlet icons and Gambling skill point. :/ Nikel _{Talk – Vote!} 12:24, April 30, 2013 (UTC)

Some dragon moodlets should be added... like when they breathe fire or like that... Cavia (wheek • speak) 14:12, April 30, 2013 (UTC)

Redesigning and redefining templateEdit

Please take a look at my sandbox for a new, proposed template to replace this. This is remade due to the confusing term "life state" for animals, and therefore I made this to list all possible animal types instead of "state". Nikel _{Talk – Vote!} 12:53, April 30, 2013 (UTC)

This may sound weird, but I wanted to propose a redisgn too! Anyway, the new design you made looks great, but shouldn't Orangutan be wild? I think that Animals in The Sims series could be an OK title for the header...

What I think is the biggest issue with this template is that animal types (or life states, if you prefer) aren't at all defined in the game (except Unicorn). Because of that, I think that it's hard to make out what should be in the template and what shouldn't. Also, why isn't Penguin in the template at all? Even though it's a moving object, it still has some unique interactions and animations...

One more thing. I noticed that Sim Life states template is getting crowdy, and with more Sims games coming, the template will get messier (Mermaid in IP, Robot (probably) in Time Travel, etc.). Should we apply the same design to that template too? Cavia (wheek • speak) 14:10, April 30, 2013 (UTC)

Orangutan may be half-wild half-domestic, but since they appear as a "pet" in Castaway Stories, I opted to include them as "Domesticated." The title isn't really necessary IMO, since navigation templates like careers, skills, and life states don't have the "in The Sims series" appended in the title. This excludes neighborhood navigation templates, though. :/ I wanna hear your idea about your design. This is the best I can do by simplifying everything without having the need to remove essential information (basically the game in which they appear seems redundant :/). Sim Life states template is another thing, we'll discuss it in its talk page for convenience.

The essential point in this template is because of this "nothing really defines an animal species" in the game, unlike life states. I am aware of this, and we all are too, but we do know that the raccoon or skunk NPCs imply themselves to be a raccoon and a skunk, despite being based on a cat. Because of this, there's no good explanation why a certain animal is not included in this template, like the discussions we had in the past. I, therefore, decided to just include them all because we don't know how to distinguish an animal with another. We know a deer is not a wolf, so we ultimately need to include them all, right?

P.S.: Penguin did make it in the template. Look closely. ;) Nikel _{Talk – Vote!} 14:46, May 7, 2013 (UTC)

Island Paradise Edit

I think you need to add the Shark and the Kraken... —Preceding unsigned comment added by Ariel Baron (talk • contribs) (UTC) - Please sign your comments with ~~~~

Remember, we're still discussing about revamping the entire template above there. Nikel _{Talk – Vote!} 13:46, May 17, 2013 (UTC)